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the weblog and site of Matthew Weier O'Phinney

Tuesday, June 6. 2006

The light has not set on PHP

I ran across a blog post entitled "Why the Light Has Gone Out on LAMP" earlier today, and felt compelled to respond.

First, a rant: somehow, this article got posted on Slashdot. I've never heard of the guy who posted it, and some quick googling shows that he's a pythoner. He's simply fueling the language wars, and the slashdot post opened up a huge debate that need not have occurred. I think it was irresponsible of the Slashdot editors to post it.

In the post, the author makes an analogy of using PHP + MySQL as the equivalent of using BASIC, and then uses a quote that claims BASIC "has become the leading cause of brain-damage in proto-hackers."

I'm sorry, but using a language doesn't cause brain damage. And there are many levels to programming. And using Python, Ruby, C, C++, Java, etc., does not automatically make you a better programmer than those using one of "those other languages". You can write crap code in any language. You can also write great code in just about any language.

Programming takes practice; programming well takes a lot of practice. You get better at it by learning more about programming practices, and applying them to your language. Part of programming is also learning when a particular language is suited to a task, and when it isn't. Python works for the web, but it's not particularly suited to it; similarly, you can write web servers in PHP, but that doesn't mean you should.

Stop the language wars already! Stop writing incendiary pieces about a language you don't use regularly or never gained particular proficiency in, and code already!

Posted by Matthew Weier O'Phinney in PHP, Programming at 13:35 | Comments (10) | Trackbacks (0)

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In two words: Thank you!
#1 Christian Machmeier (Link) on 2006-06-06 15:05 (Reply)
Well put.
#2 fatg (Link) on 2006-06-06 15:27 (Reply)
sorry to bother you: i think every language has its own ways of bullshitting.
PHP has many ... maybe a bit more than other languages, just because its missing some basic structure (needlehaystack issues) ..... so far its cool to script with php but there is better stuff (technically) . And everyone who is not aware of that .... should believe in that ... not my problem ...
#3 Sebs on 2006-06-07 04:32 (Reply)
Firs't of all I love PHP.
Second, Sebs:
Here's the nice solution to the lang'war, mentioned by Matthew.
Every language has its purpose. It is possible to do anything in any language, but ... is it necessary? SEBS ?!? C and C++ are great, no doubt, but would you develop a web portal via any of them? What about BASH?
PHP is ment to serve the web, that's what it's good for. It is simple for its purpose and should stay so (would you ever need any "needlehaystack" complexity in this context?).
You can develop OpenGL in PHP, but this is for mindloosers.
Belive me - I've tried! Remember what KISS stands for?
Sorry for the Flood.
#3.1 boyan (Link) on 2006-06-07 08:41 (Reply)
Good example boyan, PHP might be better than BASIC for what you want to do with it. What if there was a language that much better again than PHP? Wouldn't you want to use it?

Douglas
#3.1.1 Douglas Livingstone on 2006-07-25 18:14 (Reply)
Well, I'll answer with my favourite phrase - "It depends!!!".
It depends on if that lang is still simple for its purpose (KISS), if it is as popular than the one I currently use (since finally I want people to easily use what I've created) and etc. If all of the above... why not, since it'll ease the coding pain.... You know it is a little like the girfriends stuff: you love the current one and want to die with her, but when the new better one comes... you just fall in love... leave the old one with some pain in the heart and only the good memories stay in your mind...

Have a nice work.
#3.1.1.1 Boyan Djumakov (Link) on 2006-10-17 16:23 (Reply)
This is the same kind of debate with the Linux distros struck me some time back, a user whining about a Linux distro not working out of the box as his favorite distro did. Comparing Slackware to Gentoo, to be more specific. I did the same thing as you, but more of a bashing way... and quoting the manual to prove the points invalid. Post is if anyone is interested: http://www.dragonboricua.net/2005/11/07/rants-for-the-masses-issue-1/
#4 Elisamuel Resto (Link) on 2006-06-21 01:24 (Reply)
Well maybe it does not cause a brain damage, but after two years of coding in PHP4 I had great problems with producing quality code in C, cause PHP simplified many aspects of software development. This can`t be of course treated as a language`s great advantage.
#5 freeplatypus on 2006-07-03 09:18 (Reply)
can`t = can

grrr... bad spelling due to strange keyboard.
#5.1 freeplatypus on 2006-07-03 09:21 (Reply)
C and PHP have entirely different domains -- one is a compiled, statically typed language, the other is an interpreted, dynamically typed language. The habits and styles used to code in each are going to be very different. Going from PHP to C is going to require changes in coding habits -- as will going from C to PHP.

My personal feeling on the issue is that a good programmer is a good programmer. If she knows several languages well, she'll be able to code quality code in any of those languages; it's a mental exercise switching gears and targeting a particular language, but she will know the strengths and weaknesses of each and which language works best for a given situation.
#5.2 Matthew Weier O'Phinney (Link) on 2006-07-03 09:55 (Reply)

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